Re: RARA-AVIS: greatest noir or detective protags

From: Stephen Burridge (stephen.burridge@gmail.com)
Date: 03 Aug 2009

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    Actually I see that "The Thirty-Nine Steps" appeared in 1915, not before WW1 as I mistakenly said.

    Stephen

    On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 1:45 PM, Stephen Burridge <stephen.burridge@gmail.com
    > wrote:

    > I guess it's a matter of definition, as usual. I think of the "hardboiled"
    > tradition as beginning more or less with Hammett or his immediate Black Mask
    > predecessors and contemporaries, and involving fairly cynical, usually
    > American tough guy protagonists. Hannay's the hero of a series of adventure
    > stories, the first of which appeared before WW1. He's a tough, rather
    > unreflective man of action; also a rich, conservative, patriotic Brit with a
    > chivalrous attitude to women. I don't think he has much to do with the
    > hardboiled tradition as I understand it. I certainly agree that Buchan was
    > a major influence on British spy fiction, but I think that's something
    > else.
    >
    >
    > On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 12:42 PM, Patrick King <abrasax93@yahoo.com> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>
    >> I'm absolutely certain that Hannay was a huge influence on Ian Fleming's
    >> James Bond, because Fleming said so. Published in 1915,The 39 Steps was
    >> extremely popular on both sides of the Atlantic during WWI. Neither Chandler
    >> nor Hammett could have avoided it. The Hitchock movie which came out 20
    >> years later adding romance to the idea, was also very popular, but mitigated
    >> Hannay's resourcefulness learned in the African bush. Hannay in the movie
    >> was from Canada! The story sure as hell influenced Hollywood because every
    >> second movie was, and continues to be, about an innocent man who must flee
    >> and solve the crime he is accused of. Hannay may not be noir, as he is
    >> always successful against the longest odds, but when it comes to hardboiled,
    >> Richard Hannay is the source of the Nile!
    >>
    >> Patrick King
    >>
    >> --- On Sun, 8/2/09, Stephen Burridge <stephen.burridge@gmail.com<stephen.burridge%40gmail.com>>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >> From: Stephen Burridge <stephen.burridge@gmail.com<stephen.burridge%40gmail.com>
    >> >
    >> Subject: Re: RARA-AVIS: greatest noir or detective protags
    >> To: rara-avis-l@yahoogroups.com <rara-avis-l%40yahoogroups.com>
    >> Date: Sunday, August 2, 2009, 2:47 PM
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> I like Buchan, but I don't think he wrote hardboiled or noir fiction, and
    >> I
    >>
    >> don't think Hannay is a noir character at all.
    >>
    >> Stephen
    >>
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