Re: RARA-AVIS: greatest noir or detective protags

From: Stephen Burridge (stephen.burridge@gmail.com)
Date: 03 Aug 2009

  • Next message: Stephen Burridge: "Re: RARA-AVIS: greatest noir or detective protags"

    I guess it's a matter of definition, as usual. I think of the "hardboiled" tradition as beginning more or less with Hammett or his immediate Black Mask predecessors and contemporaries, and involving fairly cynical, usually American tough guy protagonists. Hannay's the hero of a series of adventure stories, the first of which appeared before WW1. He's a tough, rather unreflective man of action; also a rich, conservative, patriotic Brit with a chivalrous attitude to women. I don't think he has much to do with the hardboiled tradition as I understand it. I certainly agree that Buchan was a major influence on British spy fiction, but I think that's something else.

    On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 12:42 PM, Patrick King <abrasax93@yahoo.com> wrote:

    >
    >
    > I'm absolutely certain that Hannay was a huge influence on Ian Fleming's
    > James Bond, because Fleming said so. Published in 1915,The 39 Steps was
    > extremely popular on both sides of the Atlantic during WWI. Neither Chandler
    > nor Hammett could have avoided it. The Hitchock movie which came out 20
    > years later adding romance to the idea, was also very popular, but mitigated
    > Hannay's resourcefulness learned in the African bush. Hannay in the movie
    > was from Canada! The story sure as hell influenced Hollywood because every
    > second movie was, and continues to be, about an innocent man who must flee
    > and solve the crime he is accused of. Hannay may not be noir, as he is
    > always successful against the longest odds, but when it comes to hardboiled,
    > Richard Hannay is the source of the Nile!
    >
    > Patrick King
    >
    > --- On Sun, 8/2/09, Stephen Burridge <stephen.burridge@gmail.com<stephen.burridge%40gmail.com>>
    > wrote:
    >
    > From: Stephen Burridge <stephen.burridge@gmail.com<stephen.burridge%40gmail.com>
    > >
    > Subject: Re: RARA-AVIS: greatest noir or detective protags
    > To: rara-avis-l@yahoogroups.com <rara-avis-l%40yahoogroups.com>
    > Date: Sunday, August 2, 2009, 2:47 PM
    >
    >
    >
    > I like Buchan, but I don't think he wrote hardboiled or noir fiction, and I
    >
    > don't think Hannay is a noir character at all.
    >
    > Stephen
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