Re: RARA-AVIS: Re: The Dark Knight

From: Steve Novak (
Date: 23 Jul 2008

  • Next message: Mark R. Harris: "Re: RARA-AVIS: Re: The Dark Knight"

    Sorry friends but Batman noir???!!!....a superhero noir??????!!!!!!!!...arenąt the two words almost opposites...

    I guess that is part of another post-and super-post-modern version of noir???

    Seriously: I just donąt get this at all!..


    On 7/23/08 10:42 AM, "William" <> wrote:

    > I was a little dazzled that the "disappearing pencil" trick got past
    > censors in a film that was guaranteed to attract kids (I saw
    > 5-year-olds at my showing).
    > I think Batman has always been superhero noir. The character's roots
    > are a mish-mash of gothic novel tropes with a Dick Tracy rogue's
    > gallery. Then the works that redefined him in the 80s-90s (Dark Knight
    > Returns, Year One, Killing Joke, Arkham Asylum, The Animated Series)
    > were all heavily influenced by classic crime fiction and existentialism.
    > That's a pretty good noir pedigree if you ask me and Nolan has been
    > very smart at pulling all this together.
    > The exploration of the Joker's motives was definitely the most
    > compelling part of the film and Nolan made his world view dominant by
    > giving him that final up-is-down, right-is-wrong levitating soliloquy.
    > It's good that Ledger was such a force in the film because without him
    > the movie is basically a Sharper Image(™) Death Wish 3.
    > Hopefully (though I doubt it) Alan Moore got a paycheck because the
    > best Joker moments were all from Killing Joke.
    > --- In <> ,
    > "Nathan Cain" <IndieCrime@...> wrote:
    >> >
    >> > Has anyone else seen The Dark Knight? Would anyone else say it's a
    >> > superhero noir? This was a rather surprising movie, especially for a
    >> > summer blockbuster because of the villain's utter lack of motive
    >> > beyond a desire to cause chaos and because (Spoiler Ahead):

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