Re: RARA-AVIS: Noir with no crime?

From: Allan Guthrie ( allan@allanguthrie.co.uk)
Date: 08 Jan 2007


I think the Greeks might take issue with you on that. OEDIPUS REX?

Al

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: uplandharmabooks
  To: rara-avis-l@yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 1:06 AM
  Subject: Re: RARA-AVIS: Noir with no crime?

  Patrick wrote:
  Surely,
  Dostoyevsky's "Crime and Punishment" is the template
  for all the noir novels that came after it.

  I joke with my husband that Hamlet, Romeo and Juliet, or Richard III
  was the first noir. LOL

  Amy

  --- In rara-avis-l@yahoogroups.com, Patrick King <abrasax93@...> wrote:
>
> "On the Road" by Jack Kerouac, "Tropic of Capricorn"
> by Henry Miller, "The Grapes of Wrath" by John
> Steinbeck although there are murders and other crimes
> in that one, it's not really 'about' the crimes. To be
> truly 'noir' though, I think the character has to be
> driven to positively desperate acts in order to
> achieve a dream the reader can see clearly he can
> never achieve due to his character flaws. Surely,
> Dostoyevsky's "Crime and Punishment" is the template
> for all the noir novels that came after it.
>
> Patrick King
> --- Michael Robison <miker_zspider@...> wrote:
>
> > This was touched on earlier. Noir almost always
> > involves crime. Can you name any novels that you
> > consider to be noir that do not involve crime?
> >
> > Thank you, miker
> >
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