I don't really agree with you here, Jim. Noir concerns the
nature of the hero. Sam Spade and Philip Marlow are hard
boiled characters. They may not be 100% in line with the
police. They may be rebels in the face of authority. But they
are always on the side of
"good." They may be indiscreet, but they will never fail to
out a killer even if they love her. Noir characters, on the
other hand, are morally of a different stripe. The characters
in Jim Thompson and James M. Cain's work are perfectly
disposed to do evil if they encounter the right woman or the
wrong opportunity. Amorality, not atmosphere, is the heart
and nature of noir. Amorality is a socio/political problem.
Noir always poses a question of the right direction to take,
and the fruits of the easy decision.
Patrick King
--- JIM DOHERTY <
jimdohertyjr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Jay,
>
> Re your question below:
>
> "I assume that novelists who can
> be called noir, like Cain, McCoy, Algren,
Dahlberg,
> Fante, or Benjamin Appel are not social reformers
or
> proletarian novelists inciting to social change,
and
> that social reformers like James T Farrell, John
Dos
>
> Passos or Michael Gold, however much they deal
with
> evil, the criminal underclass, and
political
> corruption, cannot be considered noir or
hardboiled.
> Does this distinction make sense?"
>
> No, it doesn't.
>
> Hard-boiled is about attitude and style,
not
> politics.
> Noir is about tone and atmosphere, not
politics.
>
> If it's tough and colloquial, it's
hard-boiled.
>
> If it's dark and sinister, it's noir.
>
> If it's tough and colloquial, AND dark and
sinister,
> it's hard-boiled AND noir.
>
> If it's any of those things, and the writer has
a
> political ax to grind, either right-wing
or
> left-wing,
> then it's hard-boiled, or noir, or hard-boiled
AND
> noir, with either a right-wing ax to grind, or
a
> left-wing ax to grind.
>
> In other words, that the writer may be considered
a
> social reformer, or may consider himself a
social
> reformer, doesn't enter into the
equation.
>
> JIM DOHERTY
>
>
>
>
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