Ray said:
While I consider Batman hard-boiled (and noir), one of MY
defining characteristics of hard-boiled is that you could
drop this guy into a bucket-of-blood roadhouse and he'd be at
home. He wouldn't have to be a drunk, or even drink, but he
would know how to act and what not to say. That's why (in my
opinion) Matt Helm is hard-boiled and James Bond is not. Bond
is a gentleman adventurer.
For female characters, it's a little tougher to figure
out.
Ray
I assume Ray is talking about dropping Matt Helm into a
bucket-of-blood roadhouse and not Batman. I imagine Batman
would create a stir, and perhaps prompt some requests for
autographs, but doubt he would "be at home."
I completely agree with Ray about Matt Helm and James Bond.
Helm (and Joe Gall) I consider HB but not James Bond. One of
the more interesting tidbits in this sometimes tedious
discussion was someone's remark that Fleming's Bond traced
his heritage to adventure writers like Talbot Mundy. I never
thought of that before but Mundy's Jimgrim might well have
been a precursor to Bond. As a fan of Mundy's, that was an
interesting thought. Fleming, of course, came from a
prominent British family and Mundy was the black sheep of all
black sheep of his.
Now to Lee Marvin and Mel Gibson. Yeah, Marvin was the real
thing. If you want a real hoot, rent his "Shack Out On 101"
from 1955 with Frank Lovejoy, Terry Moore and Keenan Wynn.
While I have not seen Mel's Hamlet, I do recall Marvin's role
in "The Iceman Cometh" and he did a good job with that
O'Neil. Perhaps not Jason Robards, Jr. but a solid job. And
man his "Emperor of the North" for Aldrich was wonderful. I
have come to appreciate Marvin's
"Point Blank" after the false start of seeing it at first
release and arriving five minues late. I was lost in the
flashbacks.
And somebody mentioned Bruce Taylor, formerly a mystery
bookstore owner in SF and now relocated to Tuscany. I really
do miss that big guy but am glad someone I admire and respect
managed to make it to one of the truly lovely spots on this
planet.
Finally, I think K.C. Constantine's Mario Balzac made my
final list of 20. I have not gone back to check but if he
didn't, he should have. Is he truly HB? It might be close but
he makes it in my book.
Richard Moore
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