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Re: RARA-AVIS: Working towards a definition of sorts 

I don't think the use of "noir" in reference to writing is any more
"arbitrary" than its use in reference to film.  "The French" may have used
the term FIRST to describe a certain kind of American film, but the term
*roman noir* was being used not long thereafter (though as a term it
doesn't have the kind of currency that *film noir* does).  There is of
course the famous French *Serie Noire* in which Himes and others
published.  And since many MANY of the classic *films noirs* are
adaptations of hardboiled stories and novels, finding the "true" origins
of noir seems a little like asking "which came first, the chicken or the
egg?" *Noir* was used critically first to describe film, later writing,
but since the films' thematic origins are In The Writing, *noir* seems a
perfectly appropriate (if general) way of describing much crime fiction.
======================                 =================================
Michael D. Sharp                       "And trewely he were a greet fool 
msharp@umich.edu                       that wolde kisse the mouth of a 
Department of English                  brennynge oven or of a fourneys."
University of Michigan                              --The Parson
                        

On Sun, 26 Jan 1997, Virginia Conn wrote:

> Film noir is a term that was coined by the french after WWII, when
> many of the films of the 30s & 40s made their way to Europe.  It's
> use in literature is arbitrary, because it refers to film.  Therefore,
> what is noir in film can retroactively be applied to literature, if
> the film is true to a literary source.  Noir has to do with the dark
> lighting/look of the films, which help convey the desparate mood of
> the characters, their trapped existence.  Noir is cinematic in its
> root & unless a book keeps refering to darkly lit scenes <G> it 
> refers only to mood.
> 
> I always think of hardboiled characters of being in control of their
> destiny, even if they choose to crash and burn.  Many noir characters
> in film choose to end their trap with death (as when Mitchum drives
> off a cliff in OUT OF THE PAST), but it's not a very good strategy
> for a serial character.
> 
> There's a wonderful new book (1996) FILM NOIR READER, which has many
> informative essays on noir.  Edited by Alain Silver and James Ursini,
> there are excerpts on the web (sorry I don't have the URL...I liked
> them so much I bought the book!)  But if you search FILM NOIR you'll
> find them.  Published by Limelight Editions.
> 
> Hope this helps in some small way
> 
> Virginia
> 
> On 26 Jan 1997 RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU wrote:
> 
> > Jim and others: Concerning your comment about noir not yet existing as
> > a literary term when POSTMAN was published, can you or anyone tell us
> > when the term noir was first applied to literature? Who did it and can
> > you give the cite? Not that I'm doubting you, I've just mulled this over
> > from time to time and would like to read about it.
> > Thank,
> > 
> > Richard King
> > rking@vunet.vinu.edu
> > 
> > -
> > # RARA-AVIS:  To unsubscribe, say "unsubscribe rara-avis"
> > # to majordomo@icomm.ca
> > 
> 
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